Episode Transcript
[00:00:00] Speaker A: Be real, be authentic and live life however you desire because it's all up to you. And to your point earlier, there's no this isn't a practice life. This is all you got, right? So make the most of it and be daring. Be bold. Go out and do fun things, crazy things, and enjoy life and make it worthwhile.
[00:00:21] Speaker B: Run toward the unknown.
When you're riding the Big Wheel, you're not alone.
Today's guest traded a partner tracking consulting for early mornings on a Texas ranch, Dave Worley spent years advising the C level and led business development, most recently as a partner in BD at Cross Country Consulting. Following a decades long career at PwC, most notably leading the US and Mexico business development before stepping into his family's ranch operation outside of Pecos, Texas in far, far west Texas. We'll talk about his career in consulting, how he recognized it was time to pivot, what changed and what didn't when he left, and the lessons he's applying to this new chapter of his life. Wherever you are in your career journey, from deciding to take that next step to sidestepping out of corporate life, this is going to be a conversation you won't want to miss.
Welcome, Dave. I am so, so excited to have you here on Riding the Big Wheel with me today.
[00:01:28] Speaker A: Hi, Michelle. It's great to be here. Thanks for having me.
[00:01:31] Speaker B: Of course. So you and I have known each other for I think about seven years. Eight years.
[00:01:38] Speaker A: Yeah. Or long. Yes. Probably between now, longer, 8 to 10, maybe somewhere in there.
[00:01:43] Speaker B: God, I think we're aging ourselves. And so you have we met when you were actually at PwC leading business development and you have recently had like a major shift in your life.
But before we talk about, we've, well, I guess many shifts. But before we talk about that, I would love for you to talk about your consulting profession. So you're a consulting professional, probably viewed as one of the most demanding jobs out there. I mean, you know, constant travel 24, 7. You're on even when you don't feel like it. But yet you loved the game. I love the game. Let's talk a little bit about that.
[00:02:28] Speaker A: Well, I think, you know, professional services consulting is a, is a fun game to me and a lot of people. And it's an experience like none other, I think in a lot of ways because you really get to see how business is managed, how it's run and operated from a variety of different lenses, particularly when you sit in a seat like I did and you do from a business development lens, you get to see all facets of the business itself. You're not beholden to one small area of expertise. So you're kind of a jack of all trades. You don't do delivery. You really do more listening and problem solving and helping clients solve those important problems by bringing the right people to bear to those issues that are the experts in those areas. And to me it's, it's, it's invigorating, it's fun, it's helping people out and solving their problems and getting to really look at the business through the lens like a CEO does instead of in the silos and how it operates, which is I think interesting and fun and really gives you an advantage to how you look at businesses in general. I think so it's fun.
[00:03:30] Speaker B: So, Dave, a lot of people will move. I mean this is what I did. I had my, you know, I followed the perfect consulting track, right?
You work for a company for a little bit, you get your mba, right. Because I wanted to go in as manager, right. Or something, something like that. So for people that would be thinking about making that shift from industry into consulting, what are some of the things that, you know, you would want people to know? Because it is very different. It's exciting, but it is very different.
[00:04:03] Speaker A: Well, I think the biggest difference from industry to consulting is you really kind of are responsible for bringing and generating your own business.
It's very entrepreneurial. And while you may be working for a big four type firm or a big consulting firm or even a boutique, what matters most is how you develop the business, how you create opportunities and how you bring in the revenue.
And so the difference being is that you have to own it. And you really have to not only own it, but you got to deliver, you got to do exceptional work for clients to be happy and satisfied. So they hire you back the next time they. But it's something that every day you gotta go earn your stripes.
And I think it's also something that if you like the challenge and self motivated and you like an entrepreneurial lens through maybe a big environment of multi dimensional people and work related topics, I think you would be able to excel fairly well.
[00:04:58] Speaker B: It's fun, you know, it really is fun. So you brought up something that I'd like to talk about for a minute. We, which is the business development aspect of it as you know. So we're. I work at a boutique consulting firm, I'm partner here at Sales Globe and we actually love to take very experienced practitioners and work with them to learn and cultivate the art of consulting. And you know, it's, it's hard. Some people actually go back into industry.
I think part of it is that entrepreneurial part, but also it is that business development hat, if you will, like people don't understand, even though they're not responsible for selling, they may be responsible for delivery. You're always kind of keeping an eye out there for what is it that my client needs? And it's not just these necessarily. Maybe these three things they asked us for, but what else might they need that we know we've got a good answer for them? And people that's. That can be a tough thing for people to, to do who haven't done that before.
[00:06:06] Speaker A: Yeah, I think, I think you're right. I think not. It's not cut out. Not everybody's cut out for it. And you see that and people learn that. The one thing you said there that I would think is appropriate regardless of who is in, in any industry, in any business machination of a career, you're going to sell. You're always selling.
And you know, I've talked to people about this. Well, I don't want to be caught up in sales. I'm not a salesperson. I don't want to be stereotyped as a salesperson. Well, everybody in business persuades somebody to do something, whether it's your boss, whether it's your team, whether it's your client, the power of persuasion matters and whether you're just doing delivery, you're trying to help somebody solve the problem that they're challenged with and you're probably having to convince them that you have the right way to do it and maybe subtly, but it's still selling. And so I think people just need to understand sales is what really makes the world go around in so many ways. And nothing really happens until somebody sells something. Right?
[00:07:10] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:07:12] Speaker A: So I think while you may not be a direct salesperson, indirectly you're always selling something and if anything it's yourself.
[00:07:21] Speaker B: I think that's a really good point. I will tell you that my kids still sell stuff to me every single day from the time my daughter came in my room once within a business case for what she. Cause she wanted to get business cards and she wanted some financial support to start a pet sitting business to, you know, just last week my daughter selling me on some surgery that her cat needed and you know, where she might need some of my financial support. And anyway, yeah, when they start doing.
[00:07:50] Speaker A: PowerPoint slides for Christmas gifts, they want. Right. Sandra, you know, you got a kid that's on their way. Right.
[00:07:56] Speaker B: Times have really changed.
So the other thing I guess I would make, and just one other point would be I explained to people that when you're in consulting and suddenly you're in front of a client, you become the expert in the room. So you gotta be a little careful too. I will tell people, don't get over your ski tips. And it's the best place to really understand when you don't know something and people will respect you for that and you can get the right help. But I would also say that that's like another big one is, you know, you definitely are the expert when you walk in the room.
[00:08:32] Speaker A: Yeah. And I would say on the top of that is the humility of knowing, even if you are to not be so confident, that it comes across as too much of an ego.
And you know, sometimes you get in these situations where, you know, I'm the smartest person in the room and I'm trying to prove it, and that never goes over well. So you gotta, you gotta help people succeed by being, I think, humble and forthright in terms of trying to seek understanding and develop co, develop opportunities for solutions.
[00:09:04] Speaker B: So one of the things, and that by the way, is something that I do coach people on as well, I remember one time a consultant said to me, I said to this person, you can't just tell them, well, you're wrong. Like, let's talk about how we discuss this. And he said, oh, okay, so like I'm just not supposed to tell them the truth and just let them think, you know, that they're just right. And I'm like, no, let's talk about how you finesse the conversation. Right. There's, there's a lot of things to learn.
But I was really interested to talk to you about the future of consulting. And, and we know that there's a lot being speculated about the future of consulting with AI.
We do know that there is an expectation, regardless of you're in professional services or anything, that there is a productivity and efficiency play at play, if you will, with AI. Heck, we see it here at salesglobe. I would like to think we've been at the forefront, but that's not where it stops. That's really where it starts. And you know, people have said, oh, consulting, it's going away, there'll be no place for people.
I don't really believe that that's true. But I would love to hear from you, coming from a much larger consulting background, like what you think the future of AI can have and how that will Impact the role of consulting and professional services?
[00:10:34] Speaker A: Well, that's the million dollar question, right? I mean everybody's trying to figure that out. And if you listen to what's being said in the media or through the business lines of the people that are developing AI, you know, things from the future may not look as rosy as you'd like for them to be if you listen to them all.
But I would say what I think about and when I think about AI, first and foremost it's the technology is going to be amazing and I think it can already do amazing things and.
But I also think it's very similar to what we saw back in the 90s with process re engineering.
The technology changes that were coming at that time with ERP systems and solutions like that was there was a lot of talk and a lot of vaporware and so there was things that weren't really quite ready for prime time.
And I think about where we are with AI is a lot like what we were back then. When you had the 9,600 baud modems back then, it was technology that made a difference and it helped. But man, it wasn't the most efficient and it wasn't the easiest. And I think AI over time will become what we know today as the Internet. How it's affected our businesses now from what it was originally back in its infancy in the early 90s.
While there's so much to gain from the AI technology that's out there now, I think a lot of it has to do more with the admin, the analysis, putting ideas together in terms of what's available to you through ChatGPT and some of the others that really make it easier to find detailed information and analysis on companies or forecast things differently or faster than what you normally could from a BD perspective. I think that's really what I see as the advantage. Now there's companies out there that are saying, you know, we're going to be able to give you more information to find and identify potential buyers sooner rather than later, make the buying cycle shorter, all these things. And I'm sure that'll probably evolve to that level. But in the meantime, I think the biggest advantage I see for AI in today's business development world is it takes a lot of the admin responsibilities from a high percentage for a typical sales rep to be able to say, I'm going to be able to get it done faster through AI Now I got more time to spend in front of clients and selling and being, you know, in front of them, talking about their Business. And that's the. When you think about AI, what's it mean from a consultant perspective? And again, this is all me. I don't know, probably disagree with this, but I think that, you know, you're really going to look at it from the standpoint of it's going to improve all these operational functions and capabilities and maybe even down the road be more than that. And maybe there will be certain jobs that are eliminated. But ultimately, at the end of the day, I think people still want relationships and relationships matter. People matter and people want to know who they're going to be able to talk to. Maybe they can go out and get what they usually paid for $150,000 consulting project to get the answers they need to their problems. And now AI can do that by just clicking in and asking help, and it's pulls up an entire process for you. But ultimately, is that going to be what serves the purpose of helping you get through it and operationalize that, or do you need people, do you need somebody that can help you manage that piece of it? And I really think that's where relationships matter. And I think that's where the business side of things for business development will always be, is relationships are key and critical.
[00:14:04] Speaker B: You know, it's interesting because I think that the more technology we have, and like, I love, I really loved leveraging AI to help me streamline things. I mean, it's helped me just get me, you know, maybe it'll help get me 70 or 80% somewhere, right? Be it an email, be it talking points, whatever that looks like. But I think it's interesting because I think the human element is becoming even more important.
And, you know, the more technology we have, I feel like the human contact and the relationship is even more critical.
I don't know.
[00:14:48] Speaker A: Yeah, I would agree. I mean, there's. Look at all the things you can do now to buy products and services online without even talking to a human. And there's a lot of things that are really good for that. That's the right vehicle. But ultimately, when it comes to professional services consulting, I think you're still going to be ask people to help you get these things done with the addition of what AI can bring. And I mean, I think that there's certain aspects of consulting that AI will just definitely overtake and become the default answer to getting things done. But still, at the end of the day, people matter.
[00:15:25] Speaker B: Yep.
All right, so this is going to be an interesting part of our discussion, which is your transition out of consulting now, I would arguably say that you have, you're like at the top of your career. You're doing a lot of great work, a lot of great things. And you know, management consulting people stay there a long, long time. And you have over 25 years, but it's not unheard of for people to stay 36 years, 40 years. You know, they just never leave. Cause they love that art of consulting. But you left and you actually made this transition to become part of your family ranch.
And I wanted to talk about that. First of all, it'd be really cool to just hear about the ranch and what is all happening there and your role there. And then I'd like to get into what made the decision for you to finally make that change.
[00:16:28] Speaker A: Yeah, it's a great question and I'll, I'll try to navigate this so it makes sense. Hopefully somewhat interesting to your listeners.
I, I think that, you know, for me, for my career in consulting, I had, I think achieved all the things that I wanted to achieve in my career. And leaving PwC was, you know, gave me a new start to try to decide whether I wanted to go full time retirement or go back into it. And I felt like I had one last opportunity in me and I did that with cross country for a couple years, which was very rewarding and really great firm and great people. A lot different than the big behemoth of PwC. But it made it even more fun in some ways and definitely a challenging and learning environment. And I was glad to have that opportunity. And leaving that back in February I got the opportunity to really kind of look back and say, you know, what do I really want to do at this stage in life? And you know, I'm an empty nester. I don't have the kids to worry about anymore and they're often doing well. And so I, I had been dabbling with my family in the ranch business for years, taking care of things for my mom. I have a 96 year old mother who still should probably outlive us all. And so she needed some help with these things. And I started taking on bits and pieces over the years and finally it's got to this point where it made sense to do this full time.
And it really gave me an opportunity to springboard into something I really have a passion for. And of course it means the world to me and my family.
And for that reason I decided that this would probably be the direction I go. I've had a lot of opportunities to get back into consulting and business development and different aspects of that and they still pop up every now and then and I've done some consulting on the side but for the most part I'm pretty much focused on the ranch and the business at hand and trying to make sure that we do everything we can to keep this. What, what to me is, you know, blessing that you never would even expect to have and that it's meant, this meant a lot to my family and we just want to take care of it and make sure that we got it going for the next generation and set up the my kids and hopefully my grandkids someday and see how it continue for generations.
[00:18:47] Speaker B: That is so great. So I think it's a great story. Now this ranch has been in your family for.
[00:18:55] Speaker A: 120 years.
[00:18:56] Speaker B: Yep, 120 years. And you're going to set it up for the next hundred. So let's talk a little bit about like what, what happens there. So it's transitioned over time and let's talk about, you know, the modern ranch or, or your modern ranch and kind of what you see the future of for that, for the ranch.
[00:19:17] Speaker A: Yeah, well, it's transitioned a lot. I mean back in early 1900s when my family settled the area, you know, there wasn't anything really out there and you know, they came out and covered wagon and had their own horses and cattle that they moved from the Oklahoma, Texas border north of Dallas and ended up in West Texas. And supposedly the grass was as high as a horse's belly, which is why they stopped because it was good grazing land. Well, I think the 30s dust bowl changed that completely. So now it's pretty semi arid desert and because of that it's a little bit harder to raise cattle than it was probably back then. But it's, it's a working ranch.
We, my family directly doesn't raise the cattle. We have grazing leases that we do with our neighbors and so they raise quite a few head on our land and then the surrounding areas.
So there is that aspect of it and the homestead. We had several homes on the property and those are all gone now. My mom was born on the property back in the day with her brothers. And so you know, it is, it was at the time what you call a quintessential Texas, West Texas ranch.
Since then I think that, you know, nowadays you hear ranching and you hear all kinds of things and you know there's everything from what you see on TV with Yellowstone, which is a whole different world to what we do and then everything in between. And for us now what we're doing is really focused on Managing the asset of the land itself and how we can monetize it through what's available to us out in West Texas through any number of channels. Right now the, the thing that I spend a lot of time on is energy related and that's not only oil and gas, but right now solar is huge. And solar is huge because of what's going on in the, in the world with AI. Back to AI, the data centers, the bitcoin mining centers, those kind of things are all opportunities for us to consider. And we're working through different channels to try to figure out what makes the most sense to take advantage of what we can offer, which is land and resources, to outfits that are looking to put in bitcoin mining centers or data centers for AI and solar panels just for normal electrical transmission through the normal channels.
[00:21:45] Speaker B: That is so interesting to me. It's funny because we were just having this conversation and we've got a newsletter called Sales Globe Signals and we were just talking about this AI infrastructure built and the necessity for the power. Right. That's all anybody talks about right now is the power that's going to be required to actually assist AI. Right. And whoever has the power is going to win the race, they say. Right. So that's kind of very interesting, I think.
What specifically are you doing with your solar power?
[00:22:24] Speaker A: Well, we're right now investigating it. Excuse me. We're looking at different opportunities with different solar energy companies and trying to assess what's the right advantage for us to take in terms of how we work from a joint relationship, a partnership with these companies.
And the other thing that we're looking at is natural gas driven energy sources for data centers in the area. That's a big topic right now, particularly as it drives the AI data center infrastructure needs.
And so a lot of this centers too on water. Water is a key resource and they're not making any more of it. And thankfully we have water resources on our ranch that allows us to offer that as a service to these companies because they do take an inordinate amount of water.
And so we, we're looking at how we can manufacture production capabilities in the solar capacity, in the water capacity, and then also just making sure we're the, the initial genesis of the ranch being cattle farm. It's still doing that too, because that's important.
[00:23:32] Speaker B: Oh, that's really interesting. So I gotta ask you, do you wear boots?
[00:23:37] Speaker A: I wear boots. I do.
[00:23:39] Speaker B: Do you wear a hat?
[00:23:41] Speaker A: When I need to.
[00:23:42] Speaker B: Okay, that's good. Only when you need to. So I have a Question my daughter. I tell her, you know, because we're. We're country music fans and, you know, we'll go to concerts, like, now. I like a lot of modern country. I like Keith Urban. Right. And I keep telling her I'm not throwing on the boots and the hat because I don't wear them on a daily basis. And it just looks fake, you know, like, really so. But I do have a pair of killer Lucchese boots that I did buy in Austin. I will tell you that when the, you know, I have been to a couple of rodeos.
The rodeo, really? Because you have to. But anyway, I was just kind of curious.
Let me ask you. Let's get personal.
So you have had a life change a few years ago, and you were married for more than 20 years.
[00:24:39] Speaker A: 24. 23.
[00:24:40] Speaker B: 24 years. Okay. 24 great years. You've got children together, and.
And you've had a change. So can we talk a little bit about that?
[00:24:52] Speaker A: Yeah, No. I mean, I had a wonderful marriage. I enjoyed.
You know, my former spouse is still a very good friend of mine, and, you know, we got married later in life in her 30s, mid-30s. And for us, I think we, you know, both of us had never been married before, and we both, I think, got into it with the expectation that was going to last forever. I don't think. You know, hopefully people don't get into marriages thinking that, well, if it doesn't, they're bailing out. You know, the idea was one and done.
And, you know, for everything that it was, it was a. It was a good marriage. I think we had a great marriage. I think we had a lot of fun and. And the family aspects of it were rewarding, and we did a lot of neat things as a family unit. And, you know, I still have a world of. Of love and care and respect for my former spouse. She's a great person. She was a great person when I met her. That's why I married her.
And, you know, she's. She's a wonderful person and was a wonderful mother. And so I'll cherish all the memories that I have out of that relationship and what we achieved as a couple and as a family. And, you know, just because the marriage ends doesn't mean you had a bad marriage.
I think we just both got to the point with everything that life had brought our way that we both realized maybe it was time to make a change and move forward differently.
And because of that, I, you know, was. That's not an easy decision that we came to. We Worked on it for probably quite a long time, multiple years, and didn't take it lightly. And then when we got to that point, we agreed that we were going to do it with grace and humility and positive intent and that we were going to treat each other with respect. And it's important to, you know, and I know that can't be in every situation, every situation is different. But for us, I'm very fortunate and blessed that we were able to get through it and still be good friends and still have the ability to communicate without going crazy and getting emotional. And it is a very, you know, divorce is an, is a hugely emotional upheaval fraught with all kinds of issues and anxieties and trauma. And so going through that and getting to the other side was important for both of us to make sure we kept our relationship as friends the best we could. And so early on we set the right boundaries around expectations and, you know, how we were going to treat each other and how we wanted the family unit to still be what it could be in the new modern family era.
And luckily, I would say that, you know, where we are today, it's worked out, I think, very well. And, and you know, people always ask me how we did it and it wasn't easy and it still isn't easy, but you know, she's, she's easy to get along with and hopefully I am too. And you know, the kids have been receptive and I think they understand. They were older, of course, when we decided to do this. And so while that didn't make it any easier, it definitely, at least they had an adult or more mature level of appreciation than maybe if they had been younger. So. And different, you know, people do things for different reasons. And I think where we were, we still maintain, you know, hopefully we'll have grandkids at some point. Hopefully we'll still be able to get together when time and situations arise that allow for that and that we'll still be able to have great conversations and share great stories and memories and enjoy our time together.
[00:28:27] Speaker B: That's well said. And actually it sounds like things are working out when you and your ex wife, now we're making a decision know, to separate.
What were some of the things that concerned you most? I know that people, you know, they, they get stuck or they are in that relationship and they, they choose to stay. It's actually in many cases, I think I hear a lot of stories where it's easier to stay.
And what was some of the things that concerned you most?
[00:29:05] Speaker A: Well, I think we both, you know, the easier to stay. I'll pick up on that. I think there was that for a long time for both of us, it was, maybe it's easier to stay than getting divorced. You know, you've got financial considerations, family considerations, you've got years of life. And so.
And then I think on top of that, just in general, feeling that fear of failure of a marriage, right, that you didn't do whatever you needed to to make it work, and that, you know, you, because of, you know, the demise of the relationship and the marriage, you know, what does that look like to the outside world and the friends and the family and the kids and all those things. And I think ultimately, when we boiled it down, it was, are we enjoying life together or is the joy better found without each other?
And so I think that, you know, our relationship had gotten to a point where we were probably better friends than we were a couple. And so because of that, I think it also gave us the idea that maybe if, if we couldn't, you know, be together and enjoy life, then maybe there's a way for us to find somebody that we could be better situated to enjoy life forward, going forward with.
[00:30:27] Speaker B: From that point, it's been a few years and you're on the other side, if you will. And let's talk a little bit about like, what life is like now. So you guys made that tough decision, and it is a tough decision. A lot of people, I mean, listening, are probably thinking about that now. So what would you tell people about what life is like now? And maybe some of the, the challenges you had and then how you've overcome some of them and, and where you are today?
[00:31:02] Speaker A: Well, I mean, look, it's, it's an adjustment, right? I mean, going from a family of four to a family of one and, you know, you. Doesn't mean that you don't have that family unit anymore. You still do it just not a part of, you know, your daily life in terms of your proximity to each other. And, and, you know, I think that challenges of just being the age I am now, where maybe younger, you know, years ago might have been easier to find relationships with, you know, in general through more outlets because of the kids activities and the things that you involve yourself in at that point in time.
I think, you know, the idea of, of, you know, thankfully for the first couple years, we were still spending Christmases and Thanksgivings together and New Year's as a family, even though we were divorced.
And I think that helped the transition. And I also think that it helped our kids in the transition. And then I think also that just, you know, the changes and what you look forward to, you can either dwell on what you've been through and the arduous process and the task that was and the challenges and the heartache, but. Or you can focus on the future and really looking at like, okay, so I've got X amount of time left while I'm still healthy and living a healthful lifestyle that allows me to do a lot of things and have a lot of activities. What am I going to do to take advantage of that now and live a life that brings me joy in the things that I want to be involved with going forward?
Which is part of the reason I got out of professional services. I was, you know, I think I had reached the end of what I found to be uplifting and fulfilling and decided that, you know, maybe now that that is tarnished a bit or it's worn off, the luster's worn off and it's time to go find something else that excites me and makes me feel fulfilled and, and so I think that's where I am today and why I made the change I did. Wouldn't recommend the changes of retirement and divorce all in the same time. That's not always fun.
[00:33:18] Speaker B: Okay, so, you know, it's, it's funny because no matter what the change, retirement, divorce, other big changes in life, people, they tend to not do it until forced. Right. And even though they really want to. So I have a really good friend who has a best friend who stayed in this job that he just hated, you know, and financially could have made the change, but just didn't make the change because he'd been there so long, you know, kids going into college, whatever, thought this was least disruptive and all that. But like, as you look back at, you've made a couple of very significant changes. And what advice would you give to people that do feel kind of like stuck and how they can think about what's right for them? Because maybe what's right for them is different than what is right for maybe you or me. But how can they kind of help themselves through that decision making process?
[00:34:21] Speaker A: Yeah, I'm probably not the best person to ask that question, but I can tell you that I was reflecting on the question you brought about the big wheel and what has changed.
And I would say change has probably been the one thing, and I see that now looking back.
Every time I made a major change or shift in my life, good things happened afterwards.
[00:34:45] Speaker B: Oh, interesting.
[00:34:46] Speaker A: And so in at the time of making the change, it wasn't, you know, you sat back and questioned it. What am I doing? This is crazy. How come I'm doing well? I'm leaving my comfort zone, and I'm the security and. And looking back on some of the changes that I jumped into my younger years from a career or personal.
I look back now and I'm like going, what was I thinking? How did I even get that idea? How did I manage that? Because, you know, at this stage of the game, I was like, oh, there's no way I would take that kind of risk. But I think that that's probably the biggest thing is that embrace the change, because if you do, good things can come out of it. And even if things aren't as good as you expected, it's a learning growth experience that will help you be better for whatever you're suited to do next time. And that's, you know, that sounds to me when I say that I'm listening to myself, I'm like, that's. That's so trite. That's so what you hear. But for me personally, it's actually accurate. And I didn't really think about it until maybe where I am in this stage of the game to think about what changes impacted my life and where I ended up. And I do think it's like branches on a tree. You. You go here and you take the fork, and the next thing you know, you grow this way instead of going over here. And who knows, you know, I look back on my life when I got out of school and. And was in living in Austin and then made the change to take a job in Kansas. I didn't know where Kansas was on the map, and so. But. And I didn't know anybody there either, but I did it and was there for the next 13 years and loved it. And I have great friends and family and, you know, glad that I did. And if I stayed in Austin, would things been different? Sure.
But who knows, you know, I chose what I did, and I'm happy I did, and it worked out just fine.
[00:36:35] Speaker B: Yeah, I think we do ask a lot of, like, what ifs a little bit. But I'm like, you all. I'll take that change. I'll make that leap if you will. Not all the time.
Sometimes I take too long to make some change. But I think about when I opened up an Italian retail business. I brought this concept over from Italy. Oh, my gosh. It was a retail store concept, and my first store opened up the fall exactly one year before 9, 11. You tell me what happened, right? It was like, oh, my God. It was an uphill battle for the next decade because I just opened the third store. But, you know, that experience and what I did, it actually helped shape who I am. And I know that sounds trite. It took me a while, too, because I stayed with that business for 12 years and turned it around and turned it into a whole different type of business, actually. But it did help shape who I am today. And you can ask yourself those questions, but I think I always would have asked myself, what would it have been like if I did try to open that retail store that I wanted to do? Right. So the idea of this was the retail store, distribution center, train people, have a franchise. You know, I didn't want to just own a retail store, and I did that. Right.
But had I not done it all these years later and owning a consulting business now, I would have always said what would have happened if I.
If I tried that. So I'm with you. Yeah, I'm with you to try those things.
[00:38:16] Speaker A: So, you know, I go back to that saying, and we talked about this before is like that. That old saying of, you know, a ship in the harbor safe, but that's not what ships are made for. Right. And, yeah, so get out on the open ocean, ride the waves, go through the storms.
The sun will come out tomorrow, and it'll all be good. Just sometimes you just got to live through it.
[00:38:38] Speaker B: Yeah, I think you're right. I remind myself all the time that. At least as far as I know, because I don't recall any other one. We have one life that we live.
I don't recall previous ones, even though I swear I was Cleopatra back in the day. But I don't know, and I don't know what happened. But anyway, so let's talk a little bit about, like, where you are today.
You have. You're adjusting, you've adjusted, and, you know, you've got your new life, running your ranch, and, you know, what. What advice or what would you tell people about where you are today?
Then for those that might be going through maybe where you were a few years ago or a couple years ago or in the transition, life is great.
[00:39:27] Speaker A: I mean, I tell you that people ask me all the time, you're retired now. How you. How's that going? You like that?
What do you do? I have not been bored a minute, and I, you know, it's, it's.
And maybe it's a different work level because of managing the family business, but I, I think that for me, I love it. I, I, I don't really, I miss, what I miss are the people. I miss working beside great people, learning extraordinary things.
You know, one thing about professional services, it's always something new and being refreshed on that and, and the growth that comes with that and just meeting interesting, unique, knowledgeable, intelligent people and the quality of people is something that you may not get as much exposure to. But a lot of that has to do with where you're putting yourself out in retirement. And people I'm meeting and working with on the ranch are, you know, my new family. Right. My new world of influence and learning and development. And they're equally as intelligent and exciting. And I learn every, every day it's like I'm drinking from the fire hose. But it's great. And so I would just say the, the thing is, for me, the transition hasn't. I have not had one day that I look back and said, oh, I wish I was doing. I, I've really enjoyed the new horizon of venturing off into the great unknown and having fun with it. And I glad that I have that background. I'm glad that I have the experience that I have. I'm glad that I had the career that I have. And part of that is making sure I made the right plans for my retirement so that when the day did come, I was ready to do it and didn't have to worry about it. And so there's that, too. And so that just comes back with proper planning and, and making sure you're doing all the right things to provide for the future. And, you know, I think, I think that while I'll say retirement doesn't pay very well, it sure is fun and it's joy.
And, you know, the other point is you make it what it is. How involved do you want to be and what do you want to do and get yourself and you follow your hobbies or interest and yeah, go out and experience life on a whole new level. It's fun.
[00:41:51] Speaker B: Yeah. You know, it's funny I, because I was going to ask you, like, what advice would you give people in career that are, like, think, you know, considering should they retire, what should they do? And I think about my dad, and so I like to give people this example. He was over 40 years a firefighter and, you know, firefighter, firefighters. It really is a family. Like, I, it's amazing how everyone is. I had more like uncles and godfathers and, you know, all of that growing up, but they truly are like that. And what I'll say is that when he retired. So at 65, it's a forced retirement when you're on New York Fire Department.
And when he retired, he did not know what to do with himself. Now he and my stepmom, they love going to the beach.
They liked doing these things. But three months, my dad is bored now. Fortunately for him, he got a call to come back and I'll explain that in a minute. But the point is, my dad lived his whole life. Every bit of his being was around the fire department. He, he didn't go golfing, he was a runner. But it was the run team with a fire department.
Everything was that the clam bakes, all of the social interaction. So suddenly that's gone. Right?
He was asked to come back by the mayor and the new chief who he mentored, and he ended up working there for another 25 years. He only retired. Oh, yeah. He only retired this past year because he said to me, and he's 91, Michelle, I just don't think that I can do the full scope of the work anymore. And even though, you know, he's tough, even though they offered me, you know, like, all the firefighters will help me or anybody or I can get a team of people to work with me, said, no, it's a single person job, it's a quartermaster job, so responsible for all the firehouse supplies and there's a lot of fire departments in Albany, New York. He said, if I can't do it, then it's time for somebody else to.
But I think one of the things of advice that I learned was to make sure you have another hobby. His biggest advice to young people when I asked him, because I had him on, I did a recording with him recently, was make sure you do a job you love. Because he said, I loved my job so much, it didn't feel like work. Right. But he didn't have anything else. So like I say, try to build some other things too around you so you're kind of prepared.
Use it financially. Also, make sure you're ready for that shift because it might not be as lucrative in retirement.
Any other words of advice for anyone?
[00:44:37] Speaker A: You know, I would just say again, back to the decisions, obviously something you got to come to terms with. And my advice is just make sure you planned well to be able to do the things that you want to do in retirement and make sure you have something to go to. I think I could see if somebody had nothing to do that they retired and they didn't have any plans or hobbies or interest or anything I could imagine that would get pretty boring. But as much as it's out there, I think about the people I know that I that have retired and the travel aspects, there's so many things. Travels, hobby, entertainment, charitable stuff, you know, sports, athletics, mentoring.
[00:45:23] Speaker B: So many things. Yeah.
[00:45:25] Speaker A: What? You know, pick. Pick your choice of any number of things and just, and just do it and you'll probably be better for it.
[00:45:31] Speaker B: Yeah, I would agree with you there.
So let's have, let's play a game where people get to know a little bit more about Dave Worley. I asked you a couple things like your favorite book and some books that you like to read. The reason I like to do this stuff on the podcast is it's all about learning, riding the big wheel. It's about people listening to this and learning from people about their own personal and professional journey of life and taking away things as well, you know, that they can learn from. So I like to ask those things and talk to me a little bit about some of your favorite books and what you might be reading now.
[00:46:12] Speaker A: Yeah, I like, I, I have varied interest and I'm a, I'm a, I enjoy history. I like history, historical fictions. I like history in general.
[00:46:20] Speaker B: Oh, so do I. Yeah.
[00:46:22] Speaker A: And you know, I was laughing somebody, you know, World War II.
I'll pick up anything and read that. Any, any type of war, Civil War, you know, Blackhawk down, you name it. Those, anything like that of courageous people doing unbelievable things. I'm always in for exciting reading, that and learning. And the other thing I think that I like are like, just in terms of history, it's like one book that I think I go back to with when people ask me, what's your favorite book? It's Empire of the Summer Moon and it's an easy read. It's about Quanah Parker and the Comanches in Texas back at the turn of when, you know, the Native Americans and the US were clashing over the territory and the great migration to Oklahoma and the reservations and how they lived through that. And it's an interesting read. And being in the middle of that area where that happened. There's so many stories about immigrant German families and their kids being kidnapped by the Indians and how they thrived in the Indian culture and those kind of things I just find fascinating.
So I like those. But then I also like, you know, the self help books I just read let them from Mel Robbins and what a phenomenal book that is too. And just how you approach people in situations. It's very sage advice.
And then another one that I'm reading right now, which is really kind of, when I look at it, I'm not sure exactly why I picked it, but it's about Fermi's Paradox. And it's, I think, the book Where Are all the aliens?
And 75 solutions as to why the Fermi Paradox Is, you know, why there's not any aliens. And so it's just kind of interesting to read through that and think about things. And so I, I, I just kind of dabble through stuff. I, I oftentimes get bored with a book and won't finish it, but, and I'll go back to it later. So it just depends.
[00:48:21] Speaker B: I do that, too.
I usually have a few books going on my nightstand, and when I can't sleep, I pick up the business book because I can read like two pages and I'm out.
It's really bad.
So one of the things I like to do is when I'm traveling, I like to look for independent bookstores. And I like to find a lot of times the owner of the bookstore is there. There's a place up in Hudson, New York, and the, the bookstore owner is in there, you can usually tell, or a manager. And I always like to go to them and say, can you recommend three of your favorite books to me?
And always there's, it's stuff that I would like, never read. Some that I like, some of it, you know, some that I love, some of it maybe not so much, but it kind of broadens your horizon a little bit. So that's just kind of a, a thing that I like to do. But I love, yeah.
[00:49:20] Speaker A: And, you know, I like the autobiographies or the bio, the stories about like, you know, Steve Jobs or Phil Knight and those, those books of important people, people that are cultural icons that shape the world, you know, that's kind of how they did.
[00:49:36] Speaker B: So you're talking to our audience are people that are. Well, a lot of them are women, but it's not just women.
And a lot of them are in career.
Many of them like the people that are on the podcast, who it's aimed at. It's. A lot of women are in leadership. And so as we think about, you talked about your big will moment. You talked about taking chances, and you talked about making those moves and how you can think about making change when you feel stuck. What would you want people to remember about our conversation today?
[00:50:15] Speaker A: It's a great question, I think, you know, first of all, I hope, I hope people got, you know, enjoyed it and found it interesting to a certain degree. Or, you know, maybe they got to see the insights of my life to a level that they say, thank God I'm not him, or that that might be interesting. Right.
But, you know, I, I don't. I think if I could hopefully somebody took away from it was just be real, be authentic and, and live life however you desire, because it's all up to you. And to your point earlier, there's no, this isn't a practice life. This is all you got, right? So make the most of it and be daring. Be bold. Go out and do fun things, crazy things, and enjoy life and make it worthwhile. And, you know, and maybe in some cases that doesn't mean going out and skydiving, but maybe that means curling up with a book in front of the fire or going out for a walk in nature or just sitting on the back porch watching the sun come up. Doesn't mean you have to be, you know, always on the move and always on the go and just take time to relish what you have and where you are and be grateful for that.
[00:51:28] Speaker B: Dave, thank you so much. Now that is, like, really good advice that I'm going to take to heart, and I so appreciate you giving your time to me today. So thanks so much and I hope to see you again soon.
[00:51:44] Speaker A: Well, sure, Michelle. Thank you for the opportunity. It's always good to catch up with you. And thanks for just listening to me.
[00:51:52] Speaker B: Hey, it's Michelle. Thank you so much for listening today. If you enjoy our podcast and know someone who, who you believe would make a great guest, I would love to hear from you. Feel free to connect with me on LinkedIn and let's talk. I'd love to hear your feedback and as always, may it inspire you in your own personal and professional journey of life.
